forgingfires | Seasons Inbox

[ Macaque actually scowls, but he does it into his glass. ]

Hell if I know, and hell if I want to know. All I know is that the thought makes me absolutely crazy.

And I also know that MK knew exactly how much it would hurt me to hear that, and he said it anyway. He did try to reverse course once I saw him avoiding a subject, but come on. It's not like I was harping on it or would refuse to take no for an answer.

[THIS IS HIGHLY CONCERNING INFORMATION AND RED SON IS JUST GONNA DOWN HIS GLASS AND POUR ANOTHER OF THE GOOD STUFF.]

[There is much agreement in the absolutely crazy sentiment.]

...I will say.

For as intuitive as MK can be, he can also be incredibly dense. Particularly when it comes to trying to establish where he is with people. And if he was emotional? What subject was he avoiding?

[ At least they are of one mind on this potential madness. ]

He was avoiding saying a lot, it was right after Wukong's amnesia started. I was trying to reassure him that we'd have him back at some point and he was doing that MK thing where he's not fine and refuses to say anything because he thinks everything is his fault.

I did gather myself to tell him that it's not his fault, and then I moved on because I can't even consider that. I'll lose my mind. I would have thought I'd be okay with whatever until MK said that, but after I heard it I know I definitely wouldn't be.

Hm. [An acknowledgement because he has also been dealing with the MK thinks everything is his fault and has been trying to reassure him against it. Its a Process.]

So if you sleep with him after him calling you Bud, it'd fuck you up? I understand that right?

--What? No. That's what makes me want to distance myself from MK overall. Even though it's not his choice or fault what Wukong called him, he had a choice about saying something that he knew I'd have a bad reaction to because he knew the history. He acknowledged that he shouldn't have told me. Not only that, after Wukong's transformation he called me that in order to get a reaction out of me, which he also acknowledged.

We've established that he's stupid about himself, but not about other people. He knew that what he was doing was below the belt when he called me that, even if it could be argued that I asked for him to tell me whatever he wasn't saying before he told me about Wukong using the nickname for him. [ The second one is excusable. The first one, absolutely fucking not. It was intentionally hurtful. ]

There's no one cause. It's a lot of little things that aren't so easy to list off.

I told you that Wukong is the only one I've ever loved, and the only one I ever expect to, so don't go thinking it's that. I'm not getting any wires crossed. But the wires exist, and their similarities to each other exist, and it gets weird fast, especially with him calling me his teacher all the time. Hearing all this about nicknames definitely didn't uncomplicate things at all.

[That does get a look of surprise from Red Son.] MK used it to hurt you?

I don't think he realized how much it would hurt me. He said it to try to challenge something I said that he didn't like hearing, about not wanting to get close to anyone, I said don't call me that, then he said he hadn't thought it through. Which I called out for the bullshit it was, and I told him that he said it to get a reaction out of me, and he admitted I was right.

So... yeah. To hurt me.

That's when the stuff about jealousy came out. Which confirms that he was lashing out at least a little.

That is...deeply concerning. [On SEVERAL levels. He knows MK can get possessive, but actually lashing out at Macaque and misjudging that hard is]

[Definitely a concern.]

I'm going to talk to him. Sorry you had to deal with...whatever is going through his head.

It's not your fault. In the slightest. MK even admitted that neither of us did anything wrong except for the spite aspect.

And I don't think it was just jealousy. I suspect a combination of that, me telling him no when I didn't say no to you, worry about Wukong's transformation and anger at me for causing that situation. The latter of which is fair enough and I acknowledged all the things I did wrong, but none of that magically solves anything.

But my reaction there probably should have made him think twice about admitting that Wukong gave him my nickname.

So I don't think I'm the only one with things going on that would make screwing around a mistake.

Its definitely a combination. Lashing out is a pretty extreme reaction for him, and he has been dealing with a lot. Its not an excuse, just an explnation.

I imagine the anger isn't as big as a factor as you might think it is. And if it is, I definitely need to talk to him before he gets weird at Cole.

Cole didn't do anything wrong. He didn't even know it was me at the time I made that promise, and by then it was done. If anyone should get the brunt of that, it should be me. Wukong asked me not to talk to him for a while, but I still broke my word after I gave it.

...Maybe that was a factor in him admitting that Wukong uses my nickname for him. Maybe he was lashing out again because yet again, something I did hurt Wukong in a way that took Wukong away from him.

Doesn't really make it okay that he went for the tender spots rather than admit the truth, but it might not have teased it apart so much.

But either he's hurting me on purpose or he's doing it because he's angry with me, and neither of them are particularly conducive to being friends or jumping into bed. And that's not accounting for all the other crossed wires I mentioned, which would be enough on their own.

Cole would beg to differ.

Did MK say specifically he was doing it to hurt, or just getting a reaction?

Cole can beg all he wants, he didn't do anything wrong. He was trying to help, in fact. [ Very slight protective hackles raised, yep. ]

I didn't ask if he did it to hurt, I said he did it to get a reaction and he confirmed it. But you know what you know about me and Wukong, you knew without me telling you that it would hurt me to have that nickname thrown at me casually. MK is good at knowing these things.

And if it wasn't meant to hit me where it hurts, why would the very next thing he said be "I'm jealous of you right now"? [ Come on, now. ]

The fact his insecurity is going haywire.

It has been for a while. I know he was worked up about Saya, and we're working on it, but then this all happened with Wukong. After the Lady Bone Demon, and everything with Azure Lion, where Wukong keeps getting taken.

The guy who should be impossible to get rid of, and MK keeps losing him, and he may still think he's second place to Saya, and we're the only friends he has from home. Usually he has the Dragon Girl and the rest of his adoptive family, and now he has us and Cole and Saya, but the kind of close friends he's used to takes time.

Maybe he did mean to hurt you.

Or maybe, he did what he did with Wukong, where the first things he said to him was how he was a monkey and how he was his successor and essentially was trying to speedrun himself into his heart again.

Where the lashing out is less about hurt and more about clinging to those he cares about because he's terrified he's going to lose them if he doesn't hold on tight enough.

And maybe that's all the reason. But driven by insecurity or driven by anger, the result is still that he chose to hurt me in the way he knew would be most precisely painful. It's not fair to expect me to react to it so differently because the motivation may have been slightly offset from where I presumed.

Especially if it's going to happen twice.

And it's not as if I'm angry at him, or holding it over him. I didn't even get the hell out of dodge after he said it, nether time. The second time I stayed and helped him make sure there was no danger from his monkey form while he let some things out. That involved some sustained contact, too, which you know I'm not comfortable with as a general rule.

I just think it means I need to consider how wise it is to get closer when this is simmering in the background.

Was it stupid? Yes. And he shouldn't have done it.

There is just a chance he didn't fully wrap his mind around it as being 'hurt,' as more... [He pauses, waving a hand in the air.] 'This is a nickname of closeness and maybe if Macaque sees how close I want to be, he'll stay'.

That kind of thought process. Was he right? No. And he shouldn't do it again. But if he's going to be an idiot because his feelings are a mess, its easier to figure out what's going on if his real thought process is known.

And I am going to get it out of him.

That definitely was not the context of the rest of the conversation from there. "I'm jealous, so I said this to get a reaction out of you" does not connect with "nickname of closeness".

But by all means, talk to him. I'm a little nervous that he's going to think he's upset me more than he has, which is why I haven't gone into it, but he'll just have to actually ask me about it if he wants to know. In my mind there's a difference between being angry and deciding I shouldn't get closer to him than I am, a large one, but he may not see it that way.

Edited 2023-11-28 00:54 (UTC)

He does like to assume the worst in these sort of things.

But there's a lot of reasons to have this conversation. For his own sake too.

He's clearly getting way too lost in his own head and if he continues like that, it'll start hurting him in other ways.

He's an adult, he can discuss it with me if he wants to. I'm not going to sugarcoat it, and he'd better be ready to hear that. But I certainly don't want to hurt him back, or I would have done it.

But I don't think I'm changing my mind about being friends or saying yes to the other thing anytime soon.

[Man, you still love that boy, what do you even call your relationship.]

That is something for MK to convince you of.

After I sit him down for an indepth talk about self reflection so hopefully he'll stop being idiotic about it.

[ COMPLICATED. Which is the entire point, weren't you paying attention? ]

No, it's not for him to convince me of. He can ask if he wants to, and he should accept my answer whatever the reasons are, whether he agrees with them or likes them or not. Just because it would maybe make him happy doesn't make it the right thing or the best thing.

I'll make sure he understands how boundaries work better. Not everyone can just be harassed like I was.

[ glance ]

You realize it's not on you to give him better boundaries or to translate his intentions or to make sure I understand him, I hope. That's not why I'm here, or why I brought it up.

And I used to do that all the time with Wukong and after so long it wore on me. That's part of that "giving all the time" deathtrap I talked about a couple of times.

I want things to go well for MK.

And sometimes that means shaking him until the Noodle Brain is taking in the situation as it is over what he wants or wishes for.

And besides, he's almost definitely going to need to smooth some things over for me in the future. At some point, we are going to go home, and someone is going to wonder why the Monkie Kid is dating that demon who took over the city with his family once.

He's just getting off light now because we're here.

Fair enough.

Then, as long as you know I'm not asking you out drinking to answer for MK. Especially since that wasn't why we came in the first place.

I was more explaining why I'm hesitant to be closer. One of the reasons. Like I said, there are many. That one just happens to be concrete and easy to understand.

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